Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

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Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Community Legend
‎2013-02-22 06:31 PM

You can get in touch with the Spotify team directly using the online contact form.


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Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Composer
‎2013-02-23 07:49 AM

agoandanon wrote:

OK, then how should I contact actual people who work for Spotify? I did a decent amount of searching and couldn't find anything. I even posted on Twitter referring to their twitter name, just in case that would work.

 

The point here is that, aside from development costs, the P2P setup of Spotify should cost very, very little to run. I'm not really gaining anything from that as far as I can see, over such services as Grooveshark.

 

tl;dr: How do I actually contact someone in the company?


I believe Hammeh pointed you towards the online contact form. The other way to reach Spotify is via their support email, "support@spotify.com". I have had mixed results in contacting them for support. They did fix a Facebook issue for me a long time ago, but so far they have been unresponsive about the many issues with the new client they forced on many users recently.

Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Roadie
‎2013-05-06 10:06 PM

Again, **bleep**ing spotify rapes my 1meg upload like no ones business, Raising ping to 400+ in games, can i not **bleep**ing listen to music legitly and play games at the same time? **bleep** it, i'll go back to pirating music downloads.

Streaming is not the **bleep**ing issue here, the fact I have to be a provider and use my **bleep**ty upload to give other people content is what pisses me the **bleep** off so much. Spotify, this has been raised to you many **bleep**ing times and you fail to listen to people. I am uninstalling and putting money where my mouth is this time, **bleep** spotify.

 

Honestly, I come back and I'm delusion thinking they've listened to anyone over the YEARS this issue has been raised, I figured giving spotify money will keep this service alive, frankly I hope it gets **bleep**ing axed and murdered as a company due to bad management.

Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Community Legend
‎2013-05-06 11:32 PM

I know this is more of a workaround than a solution, but have you tried the web player since it doesn't use p2p? 

 

You might be able to access it directly in your browser from play.spotify.com or there is a windows container for it which runs in place of the regular client. The installer for that is http://download.spotify.com/windows-preview-installer.exe

 

Peter

Peter
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Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Roadie
‎2013-05-06 11:40 PM

Nope, web player won't work. Don't have access to any apps, no gapless playback, no high quality streaming (i resubbed as a premium user), global media keys don't work with browser players. I use API calls to get the current song information display in a custom format, web player doesn't have API to support this.

 

Last time, honestly I put down money for this company and try to be a good guy with "supporting artists" when spotify is **bleep**ing over my internet and ruin online gaming and bringing everything else to a halt due to my small upload bandwidth (1meg).

 

When I can get all the music I want for free, at the highest quality without hinderance to my internet... it begs the question why spotify refuse to cater to their whole customer base, 1meg upload is not uncommon in the UK, a lot are still on ADSL with very limited upload speeds. The fact that saturating my upload completely also effects my download, access times and ping hops too.

 

People have been complaining about this for years, I've stated it countless times and this time I'm done being the good guy, why should I pay a company that gives me a worse service than piracy can give me?

 

The music industry, and spotify have one thing the movie/tv industry dont... and that is rights to stream their content, ALL major music studios give access to all artists, but spotify manage to **bleep** things up even more for people even after we succeed in this big hurdle, the mismanagement and unwillingness to take on feedback pisses me off, so good day spotify, i honestly hope you bulldoze in the coming years.

Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Edited
Garage Band
‎2013-05-07 02:22 AM

If you know how to configure firewalls, you can block P2P upload and force your client to only download from the Spotify servers. You can also set it to cache to a tiny partition and only use 10%. I set it to use a 100MB partition once, so Spotify had only 10MB. Worked, but was slow to load songs because I used an old flashdrive. That was back when I had very slow DSL.

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Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Edited
Gig Goer
‎2013-12-26 07:48 PM

silbaco wrote:

If you know how to configure firewalls, you can block P2P upload and force your client to only download from the Spotify servers. You can also set it to cache to a tiny partition and only use 10%. I set it to use a 100MB partition once, so Spotify had only 10MB. Worked, but was slow to load songs because I used an old flashdrive. That was back when I had very slow DSL.


The problem with blocking is that the Spotify client will still keep trying to establish connections on different ports, and it employs workarounds to get references via port 80 and so on (which you need open to download). As well as register your IP address from the router's point of view on the server.

 

So even if you block the actual upload, the router will be bombed with requests for uploads at a rate that.. actually on it's own will cripple the download to other clients. And if you then block the ports, that on it's own won't stop your IP from being targeted by literally millions of other clients. In other words, the router croaks from incoming requests (and note that while I can block ports, I cannot stop the Spotify client from registering my IP as active via port 80/or logins on shttp).

 

On the other side, blocking outgoing traffic very quickly starts to drain resources.. cpu/ram actually takes a hit, and the filtering quickly starts to hamper the system from opening connections from other programs.

 

Basically, the way I noticed that Spotify was even uploading was that the router started dropping connections and having very high response when streaming other content from the web. More absurdly, the secure connection to Spotify's servers kept dropping out. This wasn't a computer I'd use for very much, so I wasn't worried about viruses in that sense. And I thought perhaps the network was being drained by someone else. But I checked a few things, and noticed that I had these absurd peaks on uploads and outgoing connection confirmations (that then weren't resolved - i.e., clients not listening to the potentially shared song any longer, or clients that would drop the connection due to timeouts that happen because the router was bombed).

 

Just to be specific here, the Spotify client was spending more than 100kb/s on uploads that weren't even used by other clients. These were uploads of chunks that either didn't complete, or were requested over and over again and then failing because of the bombing requests. Meanwhile, on the off-chance that I'd run into a p2p host that couldn't download more than my upload - Spotify would still open ports on all kinds of weird port-ranges to spend more bandwidth. Which in turn, as explained, would actually make the currently uploading slots disconnect and be removed from the router's list.

 

To put it as simply as possible: Spotify acts as a very, very badly set up version of a bittorrent client. And if targeted at a specific network, it would be a pretty effective ddos attack.

 

Basically, all the clients connect to one node, and broadcasts their IP to everyone, letting their clients try to connect to clients that are out of date, and then cause congestion to sabotage the uploads that actually would otherwise have worked.

 

That this has continued for over a year, with no response from the Spotify team. And that certainly no fix has been produced. Is forcing me to seriously reconsider using spotify at all. Never mind paying for the premium subscription any longer.

 

Note also that I'm not really opposed to Spotify using parts of my bandwidth. But when Spotify never informs me of using my upload bandwidth, and has literally no discipline when it comes to spending it. Then I'll question what other kinds of hidden terms I'm concenting to when using the spotify client.

 

And Spotify's community team, and Spotify HQ, should take this seriously. Because this has already, and certainly will affect your reputation gravely. 

 

Of course - if you believe you will get away with it by simply not making an official statement or policy-change about it. Note that in order for that to have any chance of success -- you must do the p2p mapping in such a way that normal, casual users won't notice. This is a shady move on it's own, and no one would forget that either. But as it is, you're actually handling the p2p component so badly, that you're making the streaming service fail for normal users. They don't need to do more than listen to one hit-song, and you have all upload bandwidth throttled, while the router is full of junk requests.

 

Like I said, this is worse even than the early "official" Bittorrent client. And it's akin to current versions of tv-streaming "apps" developed on the cheap. Because of the frequency of the port requests, it's actually generating worse congestion than the porn-uploader "chain-letter" exe's that plagued my boss' computer for example a bunch of years ago (you know "Britneynude.exe").

 

So here's a question for you guys. Do you value your customers enough to make a couple of easy changes to your official client? Or do you want to risk being blacklisted on public and private, personal and corporate networks? I assure you that this is a real risk - that you are risking that people are suddenly unable to use the client thanks to pre-emptive blacklisting of your servers. While that of course also would easily result in that anything coming from "known" client ranges would be blocked remotely, ensuring that the p2p component won't work at all.

 

I mean, is this really a difficult choice to make? You've made a serious mistake just introducing the p2p component without telling anyone about it. And then you're going to wait and let it fester until the client itself becomes unavailable for users? There's certainly other competitors out there. And the customers you rely on to sell your service are geeks and tech-people who see the value of a high-quality streaming service - people who know exactly what you're doing, and who will look elsewhere and promote the competition very quickly.

 

So I'm just asking: how is letting this scrape along good business? You need to get your finger out of your backpanel asap, and address this.

 

edit: Another thing is how fun it is to explain to guests that they need to turn off spotify so I can play online games. Thanks for that, Spotify. Love it.

Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Community Legend
‎2013-12-26 11:32 PM

Not that its a solution, but Spotify do offer the web player (play.spotify.com) which does not use p2p technology although it is still a beta product. 

 

Unfortunately, I can't see this changing in the near future. The desktop client is stable and works, and most people will never even notice the p2p components. The p2p network is also responsible for some of the more advanced features of Spotify like gapless playback (or so I am told).

Peter
Spotify Community Mentor and Troubleshooter

Spotify Last.FM Twitter LinkedIn Meet Peter Rock Star Jam 2014


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Re: Spotify P2P Uploads killing my internet

Roadie
‎2013-12-27 06:20 AM

Heh wow, over a year on and this topic is still a debate. Well I still use spotify, but only free. I sometimes grab a month of "unlimited" ever now and then when I have a binging month of my playlists.

 

Otherwise i am radio listener instead now. Digitally Imported, SKY FM, JazzRadio and RockRadio are all owned by the same company, so I over 200 radio stations ad free, highest quality for a premium cost of $4.99 a month, that includes all their mobile apps too.

 

With 200 radio stations, plenty of genres to pick from. If I want to listen to a specific song whilst im out, ill just youtube it. They add radio channels all the time too, had an email couple days ago saying they added 3 new channels to di.fm

 

Don't get me wrong, a year on... they still use p2p. I'm not mad, spotify has its place in my life, just one that won't get very much of my money until things change.

 

Spotify as a company is very lucky, because it's the first of it's kind. But time will run out and stubborn spotify employees will be the death of this company. Just like social networking sites never changed, so they ended on the back shelf when something better came along.

 

It's the human condition and company owners never change for fear of ruining their product; yet the irony is that the lack of changes or adapations will be the death of their company. Heh.

 

I tried out the spotify mobile now us "free" peasent users can use it, it's horrific... because im listening to a song, you still have to pay royalaties to artists, and I still get ads to cover this; same as on the desktop client. But you purposely made a bad BAD move by only allowing shuffle play. Why? To frustrate users even more and force them to spend £10 a month on your service?

 

From my point of view, that purposely made bad move about shuffle play only is a factor why i WONT be paying for spotify in ANY capacity until it is fixed.

 

Im unsubbed from this thread, to anyone reading. Spotify isn't interested in your feedback on this issue, it's been over a year so dont waste your typing skills on them, find a company that values it's customers instead of trying to force them into paying.

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